GROOMING FOR THE SHOW RING

Bellaclan · Post by **Bellaclan** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 4:45 pm

Hi Everyone,

I'm new here as I have a question for those of you who show your chows. I am a handler and have been asked to show a couple of chows and I am not familiar with the grooming and trimming that is done to them! Anyone who knows please e-mail me or reply here. E-mail is bellaclan_bcs@yahoo.ca. Thank you so much in advanced!

Also any other info concerning showing a chow is appreciated as I have Border Collies and they are quite differn't. I also show Pyrenees and Siberian among others.

Kind Regards,
Lauren

Red Dragon · Post by **Red Dragon** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 11:28 am

If the dog is correct it does not require trimming. The US standard says that only the feet are allowed to be trimmed, however most Chows that go in the ring are trimmed very close in areas to cover up their shortcomings and make them match the standard. You should see what the standard says, and look at the other dogs in the ring in Canada and see how much they have been trimmed. In the UK they did not allow trimming, unfortunatly from the pictures I have seen lately they are scalping them over there too.

cheriekynb · Post by **cheriekynb** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 11:55 am

I just looked up the "standards" WOW, what a LOT!! sheesh! Hey!!! Why do they TRIM whiskers??? I would never dream of trimming Sid's!! It gives him character! They are really long! LOL

Red Dragon · Post by **Red Dragon** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 12:03 pm

They trim the wiskers because they are idiots, those are dogs curb feelers. Not to mention when you do that you leave the dog with an opening for infections.

cheriekynb · Post by **cheriekynb** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 12:14 pm

OH, so dogs whiskers are used just like cat whiskers? ok, that makes sense then...

I'm just wondering how trimming whiskers makes a Chow look more "SHOW" like??

I'd say they were dumb too!! hahaha..

But, I guess they do a LOT of things, just like in beauty pageants, huh?

I did read that NO trimming of fur is allowed but some of the pictures I saw makes me believe that it's done anyways. The fur is just TOO perfect, know what I mean?

Today, Sid looks like a rolly-polly fur ball with bed head. LOL..

Red Dragon · Post by **Red Dragon** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 12:26 pm

Showing dogs is all about how the dog is perceived, not what the dog is, and that is the problem. They trim the whiskers so they don't distract the judges eye or make the dog look untidy. A dog with a real lite colored muzzle and big black whiskers draws you attention to the whiskers and not some other part of the dog that they want you to look at. I refused to let the handlers trim my dogs whiskers when they are shown, if the dog is that bad that whiskers cause it to loose then maybe it shouldn't be in the show ring!

Every Chow in the US is trimmed somewhere, and most of them have been scalped, I have seen them cut down to the skin almost in places. If I were a judge and saw something like that I wouldn't even consider that dog, but then I am not a judge.

cheriekynb · Post by **cheriekynb** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 12:32 pm

Red Dragon wrote:if the dog is that bad that whiskers cause it to loose then maybe it shouldn't be in the show ring!

Every Chow in the US is trimmed somewhere, and most of them have been scalped, I have seen them cut down to the skin almost in places. If I were a judge and saw something like that I wouldn't even consider that dog, but then I am not a judge.

ROTFLMAO!! Can you imagine?
Handler: "Oh, Sid's muzzle isn't as black as his head" or "His eyelashes make you look at his eyes and we don't want that".. "CUT OFF THE WHISKERS"
Me: "Touch on whisker on Sid's head and I'll cut YOUR eyelashes off!!"
hahahahahahaha...

SCALPED??? So does that happen more to smooth coats and not rough coats? I just can't imagine people getting away with that, you would think that the other show people would raise a stink.

Red Dragon · Post by **Red Dragon** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 12:56 pm

It's the rough coats that they cut down. There isn't much to work with on a smooth, and you don't see many of those in the ring because the quality is usually poor and they can't hide it.

You joke about his muzzle being lite, just about all black Chows that go in the ring have had the coats dyed, Miss Clairol should run an add in the show dog magazines!

Layla · Post by **Layla** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 1:40 pm

I went to see the Chow chows at the Seattle show this year. Some of them looked far to perfect to me & one was a nasty growly dog..... He was really being manhandled around (or so it looked to me) Others looked lovely though. I will be looking out for thr Clariol bottles next time though

cheriekynb · Post by **cheriekynb** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 1:55 pm

Layla, could you imagine? You would be hiding the bottle of peroxide for Millie!!

Layla · Post by **Layla** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 2:00 pm

It would be the back pen to colour the sides of her nose in Cheri. It's ONLY dark brown you see, not black. Poor little 'dilute' that she is

Red Dragon · Post by **Red Dragon** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 2:02 pm

You won't see any of that at the shows, and they will deny it if you ask, technically they could be disqualified for dying the dog.

There are some show lines out there with some really nasty temperaments, I saw the owner of one just about get torn up by their own dog trying to take a picture of it, the judge had this look of horror on her face like she just made a huge mistake giving the dog Best Of Breed.

I know another lady that use to breed and she got put in the hospital by her own dog, she came home and started to open the door and the dog was on the porch, it snapped and attacked her, it had her down by the throat and was going for the kill when the husband came out and got him off of her, when he threw the dog it hit one of the posts on the porch and broke it's neck.

I know another long time breeder that was telling me about the horrible temperaments in her lines, she got bit by one of her dogs and got into a fight with it, this went on out in the front yard and the neighbors called the cops. The dog was biting her and she was biting the dog, there was blood everywhere when the cops showed up, she had a hard time getting them to leave without taking the dog!

So the next time these show people tell you about how great they are and how wonderful their dogs are, just laugh and move along!

Red Dragon · Post by **Red Dragon** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 2:09 pm

Yep, that too, they alter the coats on the creams and the noses. They can actaully be suspended by the AKC for coloring the noses on the creams, and people have been before.

There is one lady from a famous Chow kennel that was suspended for ten years from all AKC priviledges including owning and registering dogs. She was caught coloring the nose on a cream, administering drugs to a dog prior to showing, surgically altering a dog, and falsifying documents. Great people huh!

This kind of stuff goes on all the time too!

Jeff&Peks · Post by **Jeff&Peks** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 2:10 pm

I agree with that, you would think the Show Chows would be the most socialized Chows out there, actually its the complete opposite they don't have any dog or Human socialization at all. Some don't even know what play is, they have no idea what they are supposed to do.

Layla · Post by **Layla** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 2:11 pm

Oh I do Sam, They asked me why I 'bothered' with a cream when we were chatting to the C.C.Club lady. I was only after information about grooming, never been interested in conformation

She then told me that she though the same way that I did about the growly dog BUT said it should be 'taken out the back & shown who's boss'

Kinda went off show chows then & went to watch the agility.....

cheriekynb · Post by **cheriekynb** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 2:18 pm

WOW, Sam, it just amazes me the extent people will go through! Do you win money at shows? Is it all about the awards and how much you can get for puppies?

I can just picture people hiding with their "sharpie" markers dabbing their Chows' nose!!

What's the big deal about the pinker nose? Who thinks up these standards? Was it something that was established a long time ago? Now I have to go back to my search!

OH, and I thought temperament was a big deal when you're showing and breeding.. I thought that you WANT to have a dog with a good disposition and temperament.

You would think THAT would tend to have more of a point value. Wouldn't you? I mean, with everyone being so anti this breed and anti that breed, if the disposition and temperament was made a big deal then it would be on national TV and stuff like that. maybe???

Red Dragon · Post by **Red Dragon** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 2:25 pm

There is serious hated amoung the breeders and show people against the people that show the creams. I do see the cream as not being legal to be shown because of the nose not being black, but it didn't use to be that way, many decades ago there were creams that had black noses, and I have seen two in the last couple of years that had black noses, but they did not come from show lines. That is one of my goals, to produce a cream with correct pigment and retain the black nose long enough to get it's championship legally.

Layla · Post by **Layla** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 2:28 pm

Millie's Mama was a cream with a black nose... She was from Hungery though I believe.

cheriekynb · Post by **cheriekynb** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 2:30 pm

Ok, I understand that there is a "standard" but what is the "reason" behind color of a nose?? Why does it have to be black? Just because??

(I'm not trying to be belligerent)

:):)

Red Dragon · Post by **Red Dragon** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 2:33 pm

I can sum it up in one sentence, "Win the show at all cost". That is what showing dogs is all about to most of them. Some breeders are very strict about the temperaments, then others don't care.

There use to be creams in this country that had black noses and they are documented. The people that say they did not exsist don't know what they are talking about, and they are probably the ones that helped ruin the pigment. I personally have seen two with black noses, and I own one that kept the nose until about 9 months of age. I have also talked to breeders in other countries that say they have had them keep the black nose until about 18 months, that is long enough to get a championship on a good dog.

Red Dragon · Post by **Red Dragon** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 2:41 pm

It's about pigment, and a Chow is a very unusual breed where the pigment is concerned. If you start allowing acceptions here and there, the next thing you know, you have lost the black mouth and the blue tongue, and that is what makes a Chow unique.

There are plenty of other colors besides the cream that have bad pigement, the breeders ruined that as well. You joke about the Sharpie, I have seen people touch up the nose with them before. Seen them mix grape Kool Aid in the water because the dogs tongue was the wrong color, seen them use food coloring as well. Even seen them take a Sharpie to the tongue to cover up the pink patches. Then they take these dogs and breed them after they get their championship and make money off of the puppies. Take those championships with a grain of salt!

Red Dragon · Post by **Red Dragon** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 2:45 pm

And lets not forget the two part chemical that you can buy at the SHOWS to color the nose on the dog and make it black. Or those so he11 bent to win that they have tried to tattoo the nose black.

Layla · Post by **Layla** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 3:12 pm

Tattoo a nose? That is just crimally cruel. What insane idiot tries to do that

Red Dragon · Post by **Red Dragon** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 3:27 pm

You got that right.... insane idiots.... that is your show dog person!

I can't stand to be around them anymore, I have a couple that I speak with still, I believe them to be in the right frame of mind, although I wonder on occasion!

Salandra · Post by **Salandra** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 6:32 pm

Sam this is very informative. Thank you for explaining this. I have as many questions as Cherie but she asked most of them first

I can't believe the extent these show people go through, and put these poor animals through, for the sake of a title.
Some of this sounds borderline abuse. Really, 10 years is not long enough to be expelled from the show ring.

I won't ever watch a dog show in the same light again.
Maybe I won't ever watch another dog show.