Pup weight and parents weight?

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ibell
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Pup weight and parents weight?

Postby ibell » Thu Jul 17, 2014 12:32 pm

Hey guys, I am wondering if anyone know whether puppy weight have anything to do with their parents' weight? Coda is getting to 6 months old (precisely 23 weeks) and weighing just about 30 lbs. Yet when we got her, we were told that her mom was 70 lbs and her dad 80 lbs. I just want to know if it's normal for there to be such a huge difference between the pup size and parent size? Also, are there any slow growers? I absolutely love her to death but I don't want to spend too much money on things she might grow out of if there's any chance that she'll get as big as her parents.

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Rory's Dad
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Re: Pup weight and parents weight?

Postby Rory's Dad » Thu Jul 17, 2014 6:44 pm

Most times there will be a correlation between the parents and the puppy size/weight. Most often it will lean towards the mother, but thats not really a definite either. Sometimes you have to look at prior generations. Both the parents could be exceptions to the lineage.

Best bet is to look at the paw size as a 6 month old. If they appear to be very large compared to overall size, expect a growth spurt. Also the head, neck, and overall bone structure. If those appear to be out of balance compared to overall appearance, then she may have some big gains coming.

I would also recommend that you not focus so much on the weight. Some breeders are looking to build a heavier, stockier chow but in the practical world they should be somewhere between the 40-60 lb range for females. Proper height and squareness are much more important to the overall health of an adult Chow. Some males can support that weight if they are heavy boned, but not females. At the weight of the dam, you are just asking for hip and elbow issues.

Keep in mind that the growth cycle for Chows is slower than other dogs. Full height at the shoulders can be up to 1 year. Weight and muscle mass varies greatly depending on diet and excercise but could be up to around 18 months. Bone and cartiledge growth plates won't fully develop until at least 2 years. Fully coming into adult fur, dependent on grooming regimens can take just as long. Health screening for genetic hip/knee certification is recommended at 3 years for potential breeding candidates.

ibell
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Re: Pup weight and parents weight?

Postby ibell » Sat Jul 19, 2014 9:53 am

Oh thank you so much! I hope she doesn't get as heavy as her mom then. Thank you for the growth cycle estimation too! I will wait till she's closer to a year old to get a nicer collar/leash/food bowl/etc. I'm glad to hear her adult fur would take longer to come in too. I suspected our trainer at Petsmart to be wrong when she told us that Coda has her adult coat already (Coda was a little over 4 months old at the time).

I feel it's a bit hard for me to judge her overall appearance since she looks longer and leaner than most pictures I found on the internet and I've never seen other chows in real life (except her brothers and sisters when I bought her) so I don't have a concrete basis to compare her with. So here's some pictures if you or anyone wouldn't mind offering any estimates:
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For exercises, I try to take Coda to the dog park every day for about an hour and a half to 2 hours. She always get so tired and fall asleep immediately when we get home so I'd like to think she's getting plenty of exercise. As far as diet goes though... Coda eats different amount every other day and I can't tell if she's just being picky about her food. We tried mixing canned food per trainer's suggestion but Coda soon got used to it and went back to eating less some days and more the others. Now she won't touch her kibbles at all if it's not mixed with canned food or rice... I'm currently trying to switch her from Nutro Ultra puppy food to Innova large breed puppy food but I'm not sure if she likes the new one better... I really hope this isn't screwing with her growth.

Rory's Dad
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Re: Pup weight and parents weight?

Postby Rory's Dad » Mon Jul 21, 2014 6:12 pm

Looking at the pics, she looks to be a bit on the long side, but that's coming from someone who shows his dogs. In that world they look for more of a square appearance (length similar to height), so that is what i look for when assessing pups. If you look at historical pics of pups, they actually are more similar to yours. Standards vary depending on where you are in the world. In Europe and Asia, the older look is more common and is preferred. In the US, current trends tend to be toward a heavier Chow, with shorter muzzles and stockier builds.

Regardless, she appears to be a nice quality chow. A bit thinner in the bone structure and longer in the muzzle than what i see on the US ciruit lately, but a beautiful pup. Disregard whatever you have read for weight/age comparisons and simply feel your dog. If you can see/feel the ribs through the fur then she is probably a bit on the light side. If the midsection is bulged, then she is too heavy (i can see with the photos that she isnt).

Both food choices are of good quality, so dont worry so much about the options. 90% of chows won't overeat, and 99% won't starve themselves because they aren't thrilled with the taste of the food. Be careful changing her diet on a whim however, as she could get an upset tummy.

ibell
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Re: Pup weight and parents weight?

Postby ibell » Sat Jul 26, 2014 6:43 pm

Oh thank you so so much! We don't plan on showing her and we really don't mind if she's not the chowest of chows. However it does tick me off a little bit when someone tells us she doesn't look like a chow or just doesn't believe she's a chow (happened to us a couple of times), says we were ripped off or something especially because we didn't get her from a professional breeder and she didn't come with papers. I'm so glad you think she's a nice quality chow!

I can feel her ribs through her fur but I can't see them, so that means I can spoil her a bit more on food/treats right? :D I'm glad we're feeding her the right thing and that 99% won't starve themselves from being picky haha! Thank you!

Rory's Dad
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Re: Pup weight and parents weight?

Postby Rory's Dad » Sat Jul 26, 2014 7:11 pm

LOl, yes you can spoil her a bit without worry. Her bone structure is on the more athletic side. If you want a good comparison, look on this site or google for pics of Freuds chows. Many of the recent pics will show a heavier boned chow, but that is the result of specified breeding. That tends to be my preference for Chow look as well, but that doesnt mean the look of your dog is any less accurate for the breed standard. Actually, i have owned Chows in the past that more closely resemble yours than what you are seeing as the 'norm'. IN fact, yours is closer to the original look of the Chow as compared with the current favorites in the US, Eastern Europe, and Russia. Most of the Asian countries still seem to lean toward that leaner look.

ibell
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Re: Pup weight and parents weight?

Postby ibell » Fri Aug 01, 2014 2:57 pm

Oooh that is very interesting and cool! Thank you for this! She does look just like those.

Do you have any advice on if we breed her in the future? In terms of if we should look for a male closer to her build? Would there be any health problems for her or the puppies if we got a heavy boned big boy?
We don't really mind about registration or if we could show the puppies (though it might be a nice hobby when we're older). We mainly want to breed her to keep her blood in the family (this might sound weird but I really consider her as my daughter and would like a couple grand children and great grandchildren and so on). A lot of our family members want a chow as well and many have already asked us for one (my boyfriend have 5 sisters and they all grew up with a very beloved chow so they're all jealous of us).
Our plan is to let her have 2 litters before getting her spayed (after she's 2 years old, of course) unless she suffers through her heat cycles before that (I read a couple of stories and I don't think I'll be able to watch her go through that). We'll probably keep a boy from one of those litters till we're ready to have a place full of chow chows running around. It's all just a dream right now though haha.

Rory's Dad
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Re: Pup weight and parents weight?

Postby Rory's Dad » Fri Aug 01, 2014 7:27 pm

My advice would be to very seriously consider the breeding aspect. Yes, it sounds like a really neat idea on the surface. BUT, you have to consider all the possibilities. 1st off, a successful breeding isnt as easy as it seems.

Females go into season approximately every six months, so you will need to identify that before anything else.

The cycle consists of several stages, and if not timed correctly (too early) she will reject any advances from a male. That can lead to fights, and in most likelihood, one of the dogs will be injured. Even if the timing is correct, there is a high frequency of mate lock, in which case the male will end up 'stuck', and if either dog panics, you run a good chance of injury to both dogs.

So, if both dogs survive the actual mating, you run into the gestation period. If your female isnt 100% healthy (vitamins, proper food, limited excercise, vet visits), you run a large risk of dead loss. Beyond that, you need to hope that the dam is a good mother and will feed the puppies. Rejection occurs at a fairly decent rate.

Now add in the vet expenses for actual delivery of the pups. Are you experienced enough to deliver a litter? If not, expect to spend several thousand dollars for the vet to do so. And each pup will need to visit the vet to get initial health screening and shots. Pups can not be released to new families until 8 weeks of age, so that means vaccinations for parvo, kennel cough, worming, and puppy kibble at a minimum.

ibell
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Re: Pup weight and parents weight?

Postby ibell » Tue Aug 05, 2014 2:24 pm

Thank you for your advice. Don't worry, we would never attempt to breed her before everything is ready and good to go on all aspects including health, money, and vet. We have a friend who used to breed his Shar Pei before his baby girl got stolen. I was there throughout most of the process of her last litter so we understand all the risks and precautions and care. Coda started her first heat cycle about a week ago and we've been keeping close watch as well. I'm just worried that if the sire is 80 lbs and heavy boned the pups will be too big for her or their physical features might get messed up because of the difference of dam and sire and develop health issues or something.


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