Heat or Urinary Tract Infection?

LEO's mum · Post by **LEO's mum** » Fri Mar 17, 2006 6:30 pm

LEO(Leonora) is almost 5months old at around 40lbs. She has been housebroken, I thought. But this week she had two accidents during the night. Today, she was weeing on front lawns of just about every other house! There seems to be no blood(yet?) and the boy dogs we met on our walk didn't show particular interest(yet?). I haven't cleaned her private bits after the walk yet, but will take a closer look later. Her appetite is normal, but she did puke a bit on morning walks twice this week, seemed like just stomach acid and grass. She was happy to rough play fight with another puppy afterwards. Sorry to be graphical, but I must admit, I do take a good look at her pooh everyday as well.... I bet I'm not the only mum who does that!

Jeff&Peks · Post by **Jeff&Peks** » Fri Mar 17, 2006 9:19 pm

Chows go to the bathroom on just about every blade of grass they sniff so its really hard to tell if something is wrong, If she is stopping every few feet because of a smell then spends a penny that's normal, I always check Pekoes poop after she goes, that's one good way to see if anyone is sneaking her snacks.

LEO's mum · Post by **LEO's mum** » Fri Mar 17, 2006 11:21 pm

Well, I did clean her inner thigh but the weather has been so bad, w/ mud I couldn't tell if there were any blood or not. However, I do think there is something wrong. I left her confined for three hours whilst we were out, as soon as she got out she couldn't hold to the front door. She must have been asleep, and w/ her body size, she should be able to hold longer as she had been doing(up to 12hrs if she is asleep and don't want to go out). I will confine her in the downstairs loo(bathrooms are the only areas that are laminated...) and put down last but one of the wee-wee pads left just in case for tonight. I've made an appointment w/ the vet for Monday which was the earliest slot, but feel I should take her in tom. on emergency. If it is infection, I know how uncomfortable it can be....and could be serious if it gets to the kidneys...

Jeff&Peks · Post by **Jeff&Peks** » Fri Mar 17, 2006 11:56 pm

Be real careful with those emergency vets they treat every dog the same and are way to quick with the sedations. If Vallejo isn't to far for you I use to live in SF and took Pekoe to Redwood Veterinary in Vallejo the Vets name is Dr Jackals (sp) he is really good with Chows, I still consider him as Pekoes vet even though we are 500 miles away now but I check with him any time a vet recommends something for Pekoe.

LEO's mum · Post by **LEO's mum** » Sat Mar 18, 2006 12:58 am

Thank you Jeff. I will ring the Redwood Vets tomorrow morning and ask if Dr. Gale Jagels is on duty... The vet I go to seems professional enough, but the two doctors I've had have had hesitancy against chows, I felt, anyway. After sending LEO to the groomers(she got into something very organic while I was single parenting her) I know what nasty growl sounds like altho I only heard it once. She is normally very good with people, but play bites me and sometimes growls esp when dark of strangers, but that is nothing compared to what I heard when I tried to wipe her butt after a walk after the groomer job. She probably was groomed too hastly around her bumm...poor girl. We walked her three times in two hours after we got back tonight and put her to bed(the basement loo) with the wee-wee pad. Hope she won't have to use it. But if she does, I will for sure call on one of the vets. Good nite and out, for now.

LEO's mum · Post by **LEO's mum** » Sat Mar 18, 2006 8:25 am

Jeff, luckily Dr. Jagels is on duty today! We will be driving up. Thank you so much. She relieved herself inside again overnight. There must be something wrong. Poor darling.... Will update after the visit.
Chow for now.... LEO(Leonora) & mum

Post by **kingalls** » Sat Mar 18, 2006 4:50 pm

Glad to hear you're able to take Leo to see Dr. Jagels. I spoke to him on the phone (Jeff gave me the reference) when I was going to have Shiloh spayed. I was very worried about being ignorant with anthesia, etc but he helped me ask all the right questions. He actually took the time to call me after hours - I think it was something like 8:30 at night!
It's good that you are taking Leo in right away. Something isn't right - especially if she can't wait to get outside. I'm sure she's upset with it all together. You're in good hands - keep us posted!
Karen

LEO's mum · Post by **LEO's mum** » Sat Mar 18, 2006 8:45 pm

Jeff, thank you very much for recommending Dr. Jagels! We went up there today. Dr. Jagels was really nice and professional. She had an ultra-sound taken, and her wee sample from the bladder which will be cultured, but as she could not hold she wee-ed on the floor as she was taken in, poor baby. He looked at that sample under the microscope. Yes, she has infection and prescribed antibiotics. I feel much happier w/ him as he is more hands on and is ready and willing to explain things, taking time. The bit I liked most was that he told me her wee smelled of infection, which I suspected as well, a sweet pus smell. He told me that he will contact me w/ the culture results later on in the week, in the mean time, to have her on clavomax 250mg twice a day. I got concentrated cranberry tablets from Trader Joes which I will give 2/3 of the recommended daily amount. We talked about spaying as well. They recommend overnight stay as well(as the vet practice in SF), but I already trust him more than the larger practice near me...Thanks again for this whole forum. We will keep you updated.
Love & Purple Kisses, LEO(Leonora) & mum

Jeff&Peks · Post by **Jeff&Peks** » Sat Mar 18, 2006 9:37 pm

One of these days i'm going to have to learn how to spell his name, you would think after taking Pekoe to him for 8 years i would know by now.

LEO's mum · Post by **LEO's mum** » Sun Mar 19, 2006 6:36 am

She held overnight! We got her out close to midnight last night, and before 6:00 this morning. She wasn't in a hurry to go out, either. Went out, did her business, came in w/o much of convincing that she needs to come in, drank,ate a bit+antibiotics & back to sleep. Maybe she was starting to heal anyway or it might be the medicine. Dog's healing power is amazing. Will try to give her much water as possible to flush out the system. Getting the horse to drink is the difficult bit, but having water on hand(Gulpy - a plastic bottle w/ tray lid for the dog to drink - on belt) on walks should help...

Just to clearify for future reference on this topic, cranberry tablets were not prescribed by the doctor. I thought if it should helps humans, it should her.

Love & Purple Kisses, LEO(Leonora) & mum

Judy Fox · Post by **Judy Fox** » Sun Mar 19, 2006 9:10 am

Bless her - thank goodness you have some anti-biotics - keep an eye on her because sometimes these nasty little infections can flare up again. Often they don't!

Little girls do get these little flare ups sometimes and they are painful.

Purple kisses from M & M.

kiwani · Post by **kiwani** » Sun Mar 19, 2006 5:17 pm

Re: "She probably was groomed too hastly around her bumm...poor girl."

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Does she have a recessed vulva? The link below contains illustrations of a normal and a recessed vulva (an 'innie' and an 'outie').

Excerpt:

"In dogs with vulval involution (medical name for an "Innie"), there might be pooling of the urine in the folds of the skin which provides an excellent environment for bacterial growth. This location provides recurrent opportunity for reinfection of the urethra and the bladder even after antibiotic therapy has been administered.

Additionally, because some bitches with this condition develop inflammation of the vulva, which will result in pain upon urination, these bitches will typically stop urine flow in mid-stream and have a tendency towards retaining more urine in the bladder than what is normal. Retained urine in the urethra and bladder also increases risk for bacterial overgrowth.

In summary, if you have a female puppy who has a recessed or "Innie" vulva, as determined by veterinary examination, please wait for that puppy to have 1 season before you spay her. By doing so, you may keep her from having reoccuring UTI's throughout her lifetime."

http://www.woodhavenlabs.com/ins-outs.html

LEO's mum · Post by **LEO's mum** » Sun Mar 19, 2006 8:55 pm

Kiwani, my hubby dismissed her being a innie right away. I asked him if it was not his male ego speaking.... So, we have checked her together, and she is an outie. Dr. Jagals rang this morning to say her cutlured wee is growing bacterium such as e-coli overnight. He will have a better picture when the test results comes back from the labs later on in the week. I thought it was very nice of the vet to ring himself.
We went to Alameda today and went to the dog run whilst my hubby was windsurfing. She ran around and played with other doggies and yes got into the mud. We bathed her tonight, used 4 bath towels to dry her. Hopefully she will be dry by tom morning.... I was alarmed that there seemed to be so much of the foxtails or its lookalikes around in Alameda. Don't think we will be going back there when the weather gets drier...
Love & Purple Kisses, LEO(Leonora) & mum

Jeff&Peks · Post by **Jeff&Peks** » Sun Mar 19, 2006 10:18 pm

Dog parks and Windsurfing, boy do I miss the bay area. If you are talking about Alameda dog park next to the tennis courts thats Pekoe's old stomping grounds we went there everyday for 4 years, Alot of people know Pekoe there. I think its washington park.

I don't know if you read the topic Chows and dog parks, I mention a Vet told me Dog parks are a dangerous place to bring your dog, It was Dr. Jagels that told me that and I agree with him. Even though I take Pekoe to them I am on her every second I never let her out of my sight.

LEO's mum · Post by **LEO's mum** » Mon Mar 20, 2006 8:40 am

Yes! Yes! The dog park next to the tennis courts! which has the little doggie(up to 30lbs) section and the large doggie section. Great place, except for the foxtail looking things. I actually noticed them everywhere in Alameda, everywhere is an overstatement - as we walked from the BoardSports Shack to the dogpark. Am I being too nervous, esp. when its still lush and green? Anyways, we went to the large section, LEO happily played with some of the dogs there, but I made sure I kept an eye on her all the time and interfered at once when it started sounding too nasty. That was one of the things told at the Puppy Class. When things get serious, the other dogs are quick to notice and could become a nasty fight involving too many dogs which will be too dangerous to break up. So stop it while you can, and the dogs can snap out of it and return to play in a normal manner. LEO also had a close look at the horses(police horses) for the first time, she was fine with it. Or could it be, lets ignore them and act as if they do not exist as they are bigger than me, attitude?

willowchow · Post by **willowchow** » Tue Mar 21, 2006 6:09 pm

Leo's mum---You could also give her unsweetened cranberry juice right in her water. When Willow was going thru the same type of thing I put it in her water at night. The vet told me about it and that it's fine.

willowchow · Post by **willowchow** » Tue Mar 21, 2006 6:09 pm

Leo's mum---You could also give her unsweetened cranberry juice right in her water. When Willow was going thru the same type of thing I put it in her water at night. The vet told me about it and that it's fine.

willowchow · Post by **willowchow** » Tue Mar 21, 2006 6:13 pm

Also, I noticed that you are feeding Wellness kibble. I was also feeding Wellness kibble when Willow had her problems. I'm on another board and a few members have had trouble with bacterial infections while on it too.

LEO's mum · Post by **LEO's mum** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 8:24 am

I got a bottle each of cranberry & apple c& blueberry and c& something else. Yet to try them on her, tho I had a drink or two. She takes the anti-biotics smudged w/ a squeeze of kong stuffing, she is happy w/ that. Cranberry tablets, she doesn't appreciate the smell or something, she just licks the kong stuffing and leaves the tablet on my palm... So, I open her mouth and after 1 or 2 tries it will go down.... I will see if she takes to the drinks. Will try various degrees of dilusion to see what she will take minding the added sugar as well. She is OK in the house, but still wee-ing quite frequently on walks and drinking plenty of water. I thought of skipping the cranberry tablets, but w/ that much water intake, I thought it quite safe(the label say to take w/ plenty of water). I decided on 1 tablet/day a third of recommended amt for humans on her weight. Yet to hear from the doctor on lab results, will update later!

One more thing, Willowchow, where can I find the discussion on Wellness? It seems to be a very popular brand around where I live. The pet shop pushes it and the vets recommend it(for a firmer poo). After leaving my breeder's recommendation Eukanuba, we tried SD, Nutro, Solid Gold, & Innova. She never got excited on any of the kibbles, but will eat anything when she is hungry enough... Maybe the choice was up to my sense of smell & eyesight....
Love & Purple Kisses, LEO(Leonora) & mum

willowchow · Post by **willowchow** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 9:36 am

Leo's mom-The discussion about Wellness was on another board that I'm on. I will try to dig it up, actually I think there was more than one discussion about it. Anyway, I will try to dig them up and post a link to them here for you later.

Hope Leo is feeling better!

LEO's mum · Post by **LEO's mum** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 10:43 pm

Last Sat. Dr. rings back to say that the culture resulted in e-coli bacteria. She was on anti-biotics till last Tues but still was showing blood around her vulva. By that time, her vulva was swelling, so I suppose right after she had her urinary tracht infection she was on heat. We went back to the doctors today, and had her urine sample taken from her bladder. She is only 5 1/2 m/s! Await for that cultuired result. She is a happly girl otherwise, and to date, no male have shown *Censored Word* interst in her, thank god(s)! We have 3 more weeks of puppy class!

LEO's mum · Post by **LEO's mum** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:22 pm

Today, the doctor rings back again to say that the urine sample took on Thursday resulted in growing e-coli bacterium, again. So, LEO is back on a different kind of anti-biotics as well as being in heat...bummer... I am avoiding her dog contact on walks, last week's puppy class was OK, boys' interest wise, but I fear this week, we might not be so lucky.....bummer, bummer....She needs all the training she can get, not to mention us parents....

kiwani · Post by **kiwani** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 1:13 pm

Did you ever find out what her urine pH was when you first had it tested?

LEO's mum · Post by **LEO's mum** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 3:15 pm

Ah, I can't remember, my hubby was no help either.... But the doctor did mention her urine was low on some other number, ie more watery for a dog...Kiwani, you reminded me to give her some yogult for acidity, which I've done just now. Aside from licking her bits all the time(poor thing) and wanting to hump me from time to time(poor me), she seems fine. There is a faint fishy smell, blood on the floor and swollen vulva, but that I suppose is the norm for being in heat. More walks,ie frequent weeing, but happy to walk for long. She hasn't had any mishaps after starting on her first batch of anti-biotics. Loss of appetite, some. This morning she threw up a bit, probably from too much acidity in her stomach(not eating enough?) or by licking herself too much? or both. I am going to be v graphical so look away NOW those who are faint hearted or eating....(One long long mucus in watery frothy yellow-green sick...)... The medication she started from last night is 250mg of Amoxicillin capsule twice a day. She gets it in a blob of Puppy Kong Stuff'n. The prescription was phoned thru to my local pharmacy which saved me a trip up to the vet. Next appointment is on Saturday for more urine samples.

kiwani · Post by **kiwani** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 4:39 pm

Re: "There is a faint fishy smell, blood on the floor and swollen vulva, but that I suppose is the norm for being in heat."

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The odor could be bacterial, blooming in the *Censored Word* after antibiotic use.