Don't let your Chow read this!
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Don't let your Chow read this!
Edited from 'Guardian ' newspaper.
Are chow chows the most stupid dogs in the world?
Ian Sample, from The Guardian Thursday November 13 2003.
Not quite, but they are certainly up there. This week, the papers reported that a chow chow from Bispham, Lancashire, was badly injured when it leaped from a second-floor window after being startled by a plane flying over its house
. But this doesn't begin to reveal the true mental deficiency of the breed.
"The chow chow turns out to come in 76th out of 79 ranks," says Coren. "What that means is that there is probably furniture out there that is more trainable than chows."
Coren's study showed that to train a chow chow to do something, like sit when told to, it took on average 80 to 100 attempts before the dog grasped what was being asked of it. It would then have only a 25% chance of remembering what it was taught.
(Only afghan hounds, basenji and bulldogs turn out to be thicker than chows. 
) In contrast, the whizzkid of the dog world, the border collie, needed telling just five times to learn a new command and was likely to remember it 95% of the time afterwards.
It's not the chow chow's fault it's so stupid, though. "It's totally understandable," says Coren. "Chows were originally bred as food animals. Who needs smart food?"
I would rather use the word 'Stubborn' rather than stupid!
B Chows.
I
Are chow chows the most stupid dogs in the world?
Ian Sample, from The Guardian Thursday November 13 2003.
Not quite, but they are certainly up there. This week, the papers reported that a chow chow from Bispham, Lancashire, was badly injured when it leaped from a second-floor window after being startled by a plane flying over its house
. But this doesn't begin to reveal the true mental deficiency of the breed. "The chow chow turns out to come in 76th out of 79 ranks," says Coren. "What that means is that there is probably furniture out there that is more trainable than chows."
Coren's study showed that to train a chow chow to do something, like sit when told to, it took on average 80 to 100 attempts before the dog grasped what was being asked of it. It would then have only a 25% chance of remembering what it was taught.
(Only afghan hounds, basenji and bulldogs turn out to be thicker than chows. ) In contrast, the whizzkid of the dog world, the border collie, needed telling just five times to learn a new command and was likely to remember it 95% of the time afterwards. It's not the chow chow's fault it's so stupid, though. "It's totally understandable," says Coren. "Chows were originally bred as food animals. Who needs smart food?"
I would rather use the word 'Stubborn' rather than stupid!
B Chows.
I
Grrr Woof woof!
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Judy Fox
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Oh you take absolutely no notice of that stupid list!
The fact of the matter is a chow chow is not trainable in the usual sense of the word when applied to normal dog training.
A chow chow shows far more intelligence that many mutts and in the case of my Milly and Mabel, they know exactly what we say to them and will consider the situation and then decide what they wish to do!!
I mean - look at it from their perspective - why bring a ball back when it is thrown and they do not wish to carry a stick round.
I prefer my gorgeous chow chows to a fawning, "I will do anything" to please you hound.
The fact of the matter is a chow chow is not trainable in the usual sense of the word when applied to normal dog training.
A chow chow shows far more intelligence that many mutts and in the case of my Milly and Mabel, they know exactly what we say to them and will consider the situation and then decide what they wish to do!!
I mean - look at it from their perspective - why bring a ball back when it is thrown and they do not wish to carry a stick round.
I prefer my gorgeous chow chows to a fawning, "I will do anything" to please you hound.
(Thank you Sweetpea for my new banner.)
Who is Coren and what is the Guardian newspaper? Some more dog wispirer people? Who ever they are talk about stupid, are they even worth setting straight. Isn't Coren one of the Alpha people that Alpha myth I posted was saying was wrong.
Last edited by Jeff&Peks on Thu Nov 22, 2007 2:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
“...There comes a time when one must take a position that is neither safe, nor politic, nor popular, but one must take it because conscience tells one that it is right.” MLK
I thought the name sounded familiar, Is this the idiot? And what's worse is some of you are reading and recommending his books, This fool needs to be stopped, he has no business being around any breed of dog or any type of animal. God people like this make me mad and People are dumb enough to listen to him.
"Remember what Stanley Coren said about forcing a dog over on her back every day? (See The Myth of Alpha (Part 1). He said that this position "signifies submission to the authority of a dominant member of the pack." But dogs don't think symbolically
Stanley Coren gives us a "kinder, gentler" version of this exercise, asserting: "You should deliberately manipulate and restrain your dog on a regular basis, placing it in a position that, for wild canids, signifies submission to the authority of a dominant member of the pack." He goes on to suggest periodically forcing your dog onto her back while lifting one of her legs in the air. According to Coren, this shows the dog that you're alpha, and is supposed to create a better relationship with your dog."
"Remember what Stanley Coren said about forcing a dog over on her back every day? (See The Myth of Alpha (Part 1). He said that this position "signifies submission to the authority of a dominant member of the pack." But dogs don't think symbolically
Stanley Coren gives us a "kinder, gentler" version of this exercise, asserting: "You should deliberately manipulate and restrain your dog on a regular basis, placing it in a position that, for wild canids, signifies submission to the authority of a dominant member of the pack." He goes on to suggest periodically forcing your dog onto her back while lifting one of her legs in the air. According to Coren, this shows the dog that you're alpha, and is supposed to create a better relationship with your dog."
“...There comes a time when one must take a position that is neither safe, nor politic, nor popular, but one must take it because conscience tells one that it is right.” MLK
Oh dear...what have we started?
Heres the link...
http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2003/ ... equestions
hope link opens
Go easy on him!
Heres the link...
http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2003/ ... equestions
hope link opens
Go easy on him!
Grrr Woof woof!
OHHHHH MYYYY GODDD, This guy is a total idiot. Its 3am here and Thanksgiving this guy has pissed me off, Excuse the expression. Not your Fault BChow, its good you posted this.
"It's not the chow chow's fault it's so stupid, though. "It's totally understandable," says Coren. "Chows were originally bred as food animals. Who needs smart food?"
In China, some farms still raise chows for meat (folklore says black ones are better fried while others should be stewed). The dogs are not called chows because they make good "chow", as is commonly supposed.
In fact, when they were first shipped to England, they arrived in boxes marked "chow chow", pidgin English for miscellaneous merchandise. "The customs people simply assumed that was what they were called and the name stuck,"
"It's not the chow chow's fault it's so stupid, though. "It's totally understandable," says Coren. "Chows were originally bred as food animals. Who needs smart food?"
In China, some farms still raise chows for meat (folklore says black ones are better fried while others should be stewed). The dogs are not called chows because they make good "chow", as is commonly supposed.
In fact, when they were first shipped to England, they arrived in boxes marked "chow chow", pidgin English for miscellaneous merchandise. "The customs people simply assumed that was what they were called and the name stuck,"
“...There comes a time when one must take a position that is neither safe, nor politic, nor popular, but one must take it because conscience tells one that it is right.” MLK
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sit_by_the_beach
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I bought Coren's book at a flea market for 50cents. I thought this was too much and haggled, got it for 25 cents, that's all the book is worth.
He's got the Chow, Basset hound at the bottom, the Afghan hound finished last. The Keeshond, Collie and Schipperke are at the top. I see a Keeshond and Schipperke at the doggie park. I find them dumb in comparison to our chows.
I wanted a cuddly, attractive, clever doggie companion, That's my chow. They are the same qualities I'd want in a human companion. Don't want a man who fetches this and that, Not looking for a gofer.
Karin
He's got the Chow, Basset hound at the bottom, the Afghan hound finished last. The Keeshond, Collie and Schipperke are at the top. I see a Keeshond and Schipperke at the doggie park. I find them dumb in comparison to our chows.
I wanted a cuddly, attractive, clever doggie companion, That's my chow. They are the same qualities I'd want in a human companion. Don't want a man who fetches this and that, Not looking for a gofer.
Karin
KARIN &
chowMIKKI
chowMIKKI
As you guys have said - Chows decide what THEY want to do - Henry has been smart enough to train me into what he wants.
The treat/biscuit cupboard is next to the back door. Henry stands by the back door to be let out. In the mornings he gets a biscuit to go outside with. He has decided that he deserves a little something nearly every time he goes out and will just stand there until he gets a little something and then head out. Sometimes he wants 2 somethings to go out with - he'll stand and eat the 1st something and then look at me as if to say - c'mon you know I deserve another one!
i know he understands every command I have given him - he just chooses which one to do when he feels like it - that's smart if you ask me - who likes doing what they are told ALL the time?
The treat/biscuit cupboard is next to the back door. Henry stands by the back door to be let out. In the mornings he gets a biscuit to go outside with. He has decided that he deserves a little something nearly every time he goes out and will just stand there until he gets a little something and then head out. Sometimes he wants 2 somethings to go out with - he'll stand and eat the 1st something and then look at me as if to say - c'mon you know I deserve another one!
i know he understands every command I have given him - he just chooses which one to do when he feels like it - that's smart if you ask me - who likes doing what they are told ALL the time?
When we took Buddha to puppy class, he did what we asked the second time, if not the first. He's smart, he just doesn't always want to do what we ask LOL That guys is an idiot. You have to consider the personality of the breed and individual animal. They are no different than humans in that respect.
Thanks so much sweetpea!!!
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Boogie and Linda
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Perhaps the chows that this guy has met assume he is to dumb for them to even pay attention to. Maybe the chows are too smart to dignify replying to him at all so he assumes they are stupid.
The other day we were at the pet store getting Teddie a bath and as I was at the check out counter I had Teddie on the leash but wasn't paying attention to him. All of a sudden he was going through all of his tricks. I looked and across the aisle there was a clerk restocking the treats. Teddie was busy going through his tricks to try and get someone to give him one. He knew exactly what was in the box and what he had to do to get one. I didn't see the other dogs in the store doing that.
The other day we were at the pet store getting Teddie a bath and as I was at the check out counter I had Teddie on the leash but wasn't paying attention to him. All of a sudden he was going through all of his tricks. I looked and across the aisle there was a clerk restocking the treats. Teddie was busy going through his tricks to try and get someone to give him one. He knew exactly what was in the box and what he had to do to get one. I didn't see the other dogs in the store doing that.
When we eat something that smells nice,they'll sit.If I pretend not to notice them while carrying food to or from the kitchen,they'll walk in front of me and sit down so I can't get past them without noticing how pretty they sit,lol.
When we turn off the tv with the remote at night,even before we get up,they walk to the room where their crate is and get in their crate.
When we get the shoes we wear when we go out without the,not the shoes we use to walk them,they get up and get into their crate.
But.....yesterday Cinnamon tried to walk into the gazebo on the back deck ,and she stood there five minutes trying to figure out why she couldn't get in.I zipped the netting shut to keep the leaves out.
When we turn off the tv with the remote at night,even before we get up,they walk to the room where their crate is and get in their crate.
When we get the shoes we wear when we go out without the,not the shoes we use to walk them,they get up and get into their crate.
But.....yesterday Cinnamon tried to walk into the gazebo on the back deck ,and she stood there five minutes trying to figure out why she couldn't get in.I zipped the netting shut to keep the leaves out.
When I taught Pekoe how to shake except I have to say give me 5 because if I say shack she shakes the dirt off. Pekoe now thinks all she has to do is walk up to any table, lift her paw and its free food. When ever we pass a picnic table pekoe walks over and lifts her paw to shake, then expects food in exchange. Don't know what that guy thinks is stupid. Never mind I know, any breed that doesn't listen to him or respond to his Gestapo training methods is considered stupid but that's like most trainers that don't know how to train.
You can take any chow back to a place it hasn't been to in years and the Chow will remember every crack and craves around.
You can take any chow back to a place it hasn't been to in years and the Chow will remember every crack and craves around.
“...There comes a time when one must take a position that is neither safe, nor politic, nor popular, but one must take it because conscience tells one that it is right.” MLK
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Judy Fox
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Milly and Mabel always sit and say "How d'ya do!" for their dinner or for a treat.
We taught them to do that to teach them to take it easy with their food when they were young.
Now, if they want to go out to spend a penny or to just go out, they come and stand and lift a paw.
So, as you say Jeff - they know exactly what they are doing and why.
We taught them to do that to teach them to take it easy with their food when they were young.
Now, if they want to go out to spend a penny or to just go out, they come and stand and lift a paw.
So, as you say Jeff - they know exactly what they are doing and why.
(Thank you Sweetpea for my new banner.)
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kryptonite
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redangie24
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The trouble is this guy, If its the same Coren, Isn't some everyday trainer just mouthing off he is supposedly highly regarded in his field and has publised books on training so people do listen to him. Next time you think Alpha training keep him in mind, he is what its all about.
“...There comes a time when one must take a position that is neither safe, nor politic, nor popular, but one must take it because conscience tells one that it is right.” MLK
I have to jump in here with some comments about the so-called stupidity of Chows and their placement on the list of trainable dogs.
First, the list determines "intelligence" by the level of ease of trainability and those dogs that score high are those working dogs whose only purpose in life is to please its humans (Border Collies, Kelpies, etc. etc.).
Chows, on the other hand, are trainable, but the system of training has to be carefully chosen. This is a breed of dog that has been in existence for over 150,000 years according to DNA profiling - a good 140,000 years before the evolvution of cooperation and collaboration between homo sapiens and canus familiarus. Thus, clicker training, which challenges the problem solving capacity of Chows, has proven to be one of the best training methods to use with these guys.
When Chows joined forces with humans, it was as an all purpose dog - herding, hunting, pulling, camp guardian. And yes, they were eaten (along with anything else on four legs) when food was tight or they could no longer do their job/s. At those times, they ended up in the stew pot and their skins were used for clothing/footwear.
As for the myth (and based on over 10 years of private research, I am fairly certain it is a myth that was born of an eighteenth century English gentleman's social commentary on reports sent to him from China by a young emmisary who spoke no Chinese and knew practically nothing about the culture). The mid boggles at the possibilities of misapprehended interpretations.
As early as the 15th century in Chinese culture, while some Chows remained as working dogs in Northern China/Mongolia, the royal courts kept herds of upwards of 1000 Chows, which were used as a sign of great wealth and power (Chows were the original dogs of war, having travelled with the Mongol hordes for centuries). These herds were kept as hunting dogs and castle guardians (and temple guardians) and were cared for well by specially trained servants.
Depending on special, auspicious ceremonies that only a king/emperor/regional ruler participated in, occasionally there was a call for dog meat. In those times, the "highest" respected dog in the Chinese culture (courage, fortitude, stoicism, strength, etc) was the dog we now know as the Chow and it was usually a young dog chosen as the offering for the ceremony.
Today, the dog farms kept in China and Korea to serve the dog meat demand, keep and sell all breeds of dogs; not particularly Chows. In fact, Chows as a pet in China (and now that the common people are allowed again to own pets, dogs are at the top of the list) are very expensive to buy (most are imported from America to be shown) and are treated like royalty.
All the best,
First, the list determines "intelligence" by the level of ease of trainability and those dogs that score high are those working dogs whose only purpose in life is to please its humans (Border Collies, Kelpies, etc. etc.).
Chows, on the other hand, are trainable, but the system of training has to be carefully chosen. This is a breed of dog that has been in existence for over 150,000 years according to DNA profiling - a good 140,000 years before the evolvution of cooperation and collaboration between homo sapiens and canus familiarus. Thus, clicker training, which challenges the problem solving capacity of Chows, has proven to be one of the best training methods to use with these guys.
When Chows joined forces with humans, it was as an all purpose dog - herding, hunting, pulling, camp guardian. And yes, they were eaten (along with anything else on four legs) when food was tight or they could no longer do their job/s. At those times, they ended up in the stew pot and their skins were used for clothing/footwear.
As for the myth (and based on over 10 years of private research, I am fairly certain it is a myth that was born of an eighteenth century English gentleman's social commentary on reports sent to him from China by a young emmisary who spoke no Chinese and knew practically nothing about the culture). The mid boggles at the possibilities of misapprehended interpretations.
As early as the 15th century in Chinese culture, while some Chows remained as working dogs in Northern China/Mongolia, the royal courts kept herds of upwards of 1000 Chows, which were used as a sign of great wealth and power (Chows were the original dogs of war, having travelled with the Mongol hordes for centuries). These herds were kept as hunting dogs and castle guardians (and temple guardians) and were cared for well by specially trained servants.
Depending on special, auspicious ceremonies that only a king/emperor/regional ruler participated in, occasionally there was a call for dog meat. In those times, the "highest" respected dog in the Chinese culture (courage, fortitude, stoicism, strength, etc) was the dog we now know as the Chow and it was usually a young dog chosen as the offering for the ceremony.
Today, the dog farms kept in China and Korea to serve the dog meat demand, keep and sell all breeds of dogs; not particularly Chows. In fact, Chows as a pet in China (and now that the common people are allowed again to own pets, dogs are at the top of the list) are very expensive to buy (most are imported from America to be shown) and are treated like royalty.
All the best,
Judith-Ann
Sengé Chows, VIC (Australia)
Sengé Chows, VIC (Australia)