To neuter or not to neuter

[Discipula]

Hello all,

I have a fabulous Chow named Tao. He is about a year and a half now and I have not neutered him. I am unsure if I should. I don't want to change his personality, but I hear that neutering doesn't change it too much anyways. What I am most worried about is neutering him given the fact that he's never had puppies or mated at all. I've read that it is unwise to neuter a dog when he is "frustrated".

Any suggestions/personal stories? Thanks!

[Or if there is anyone in New York who wants to breed, I'd be open to that too! I just don't want my little man going crazy with hormones]

[gebower]

I'd say it's too late to neuter him now. I think 6 or 7 months is the latest. Some people have their pups neutered at 3 months, that's too early. To tell you the truth I had Max neutered at 6 months and regretted it. When I picked him up at the vet's he looked at me like "What did you do to me?" I have a male and female. Female is spayed too. She is now the Alpha female and Max? Kind of whimpy, she kicks him around. Had I not got him neutered there's no way she'd be Alpha female. Year and half old? I think that's going to be rough on him. I wouldn't do it.
Good luck in your decision
Gene.

[applebear]

It's too late? Sorry but it is NEVER too late. Whether it is right for you and the dog, is a whole different story. It won't change his personality at all. At most it may mellow some behaviors, depending if they are a problem or not [marking, trying to get out to breed, etc]. He doesn't need to breed or have puppies to feel satisfied, like some bachelor party before getting married. I have had nothing but male dogs for the past 20 years and not one of them went through these changes you are worried about. If anything it decreased a lot of frustration and let them get back to being a family pet.

[gebower]

BALONEY, dont' tell me it won't change their personality. I've had two male Chows, one not neutered and one neutered. Max was an ALPHA male even as a pup and even the vet told me that he was an Alpha male when he was maybe 5 months. Now he's a whimp. Any dog could beat him up. Chevy was my first Chow, male, not neutered. I also had a female Gordon setter older than him. He accidentally went to her bowl when he was maybe 4 months old. She bit him in the back and drew blood and he yiped and yiped. He never forgot that because he wasn't neutered. When he was an adult I gave him a half a slice of cheese and the Gordon setter showed up and growled at him. I had to use a chair to separate HIM from HER. That certainly is NOT the case with Max, because he is neutered. I have to separate his half sister FROM HIM. So, please do not tell me it doesn't affect the personality. That is baloney. At least in my case.

[Laura]

Shug was close to a year old when I had him neutered and there was zero personality change. I had two males in the past that were raised together and when they began fighting at around 6-8 mos everyone said get them neutered and it will help/make them less aggressive/ etc. Well that was bs because it didn't change a thing personality or aggression wise. I realize that some men see themselves in the neutering process but these are dogs, not castrated men we're talking about. It is my understanding that it is better for them health wise down the road as well and it certainly isn't too late at his age.

[gebower]

True, i agree. Supposedly healthy for them and may even live longer. But, it's drastic. I've seen my Zeena in a lot of pain after she was spayed, she was 6 months old. When I was picking her up, the vet saw the pain she was in and gave me pain pills for her. Max had pain pills too when he was neutered. Yes, It's DEFINITELY a male female thing. I admit it. To each his own but, I'll NEVER neuter another male dog I own in the future. All done with that. If I don't, I have to watch the male and make sure I have a good fence otherwise they will get out looking for that female in heat. It wasn't "BS" with Max. He was hell on wheels as a young dog until he got neutered and everything changed. Not right away but, he changed. Everyone has their own personal experiences. I told you mine and you told me yours.

[Rory's Dad]

There is no truth to the dog changing personality because he was neutered. There may be a change due to him undergoing a surgery, and in Gebowers case i would venture to say that it was more due to being injured by a housemate. He lost trust, not ... you know what. Males frequently defer to females anyway, regardless or whether they are altered or not.

AND..there is no issue with the timeline. The behavior of a dog whether it be marking or whatever is ingrained, and not scientifically related to having certain parts.

[Piff Poff]

There is no 'time limit' on neutering or spaying. Neutering CAN decrease boisterous and some unwanted behaviours in SOME dogs( such as marking as much). Henrys behaviour and personality did not change, he just grew up and while he was getting older he learnt what was unwanted. Henry did have some problems, he was allergic to the glue used so his healing and discomfort went on for much longer than it should have done, if I have another boy I will look into laser procedures. Unless you have show dogs neutering and spaying is a responsible thing to do as you never know when your dog is going to escape to be with nearest young lady. There are enough unwanted animals already.

[sue]

There isn't an age limit on neutering if you aren't going to breed from him get him done.Speak to your vet & discuss it with them they will give you the information on the procedure & after care.Having a male neutered removes any risk of them getting testicle cancer when they get older.Having a female spayed will remove the chance of them getting a pyometra

[wokman]

My second Male was neutered at age four and I saw no change in his behavior or personality. Rescued dogs are "fixed" at all ages to eliminate more homeless pets; as we all know by now.

[gebower]

Max was a ALPHA male ALL the way. He humped everything he could hump and did it ALL the time!!!!!!!!!!!!
He wanted to kick eveyone's butt right out of the gate. He wanted to kill the vet, he was only 5 months old!!!!Then he was neutered and it took a little while but, he changed. Now, I would trust him with anyone and dogs too. So, I STILL say there CAN be a personality change in this. Okay, let's neuter all males in America, do you think there will be a personality change???????? Please.
I still can't believe that people are arguing about this. Hormones have a great affect on us. You can argue with me until your blue in the face. But, it's true. I now rest my case. Sorry you can't see it.

[Grab]

You might see behavior changes in a young dog (under 6 or so months), although how much of that would have been normal behavioral changes given their age remains to be seen. But in a dog who is several years old, you're going to see little change, ime.

If you're able to keep him confined/away from females in heat and you're aware of watching for any heath issues that could arise when he's older, there's no reason he cannot stay intact. If you want to neuter him, his behavior will likely remain the same. It's really a matter of your comfort level.

Just to note, a 5 month old puppy humping other dogs, is not an alpha dog. He may have been trying to show dominance, but it was likely looked upon by other dogs much as humans look upon a teenager posturing. Dogs who are truly alpha in behavior have no need to go on a humping spree.

[Rory's Dad]

Well stated Grab. I have an almost 2 year old intact male who will mark everything in site, but has never mounted anything. He shows regularly and is frequently around females in heat. He gets a bit agitated, but thats about it. Our 7 month old female is now in season, and same thing. They are housemates and may one day breed, but for now are securely separated except to eat, and he is more concerned with getting dinner than he is with her.

Behavior is NOT closely related to whether they have all their parts or not. They have instinct, and that largely controls the mating drive. Dogs who have been neutered frequently continue the humping behavior. And dogs who are intact similarly have never displayed such events. Learned behavior is the other aspect, and its like teaching them to sit or lie down. I do not allow my male to do anything more than the standard meet and greet sniff test. Anything beyond that he is pulled to neutral territory. He knows acceptable behavior and even with Amber, doesnt push his boundary.

[sengeoz]

According to much of the current research into speying/neutering, 24 months is the ideal age.
The body has completed development but it's usually soon enough to prevent other intact-related issues. A change in personality is highly uncommon, although the younger the animal is neutered (under 12 months), the more likely it will remain immature.
Be aware that to avoid the coat from hell that comes with neutering the best time to neuter/spey your Chow (or any other double coated breed) is about 6 weeks after the spring equinox. Light affects the hormones of the coat changes, so this timing coincides with the dumping of the winter coat and coming in for the summer coat. They will still moult twice a year, but the primary coat will be similar to the summer coat.

[sdiver]

Going against the grain... It never seemed "correct" to my mind that neutering a dog would be healthy. I do understand neutering to help control unwanted litters. My dog is now 7 mos. old. I've decided not to neuter him based on this study: http://news.ucdavis.edu/search/news_det ... o?id=10498 Adding that my dog is a house dog and I have fenced yard and when he's not on my property he's on a leash.

[sengeoz]

Do have a chat with your vet regarding what to look for in terms of testicular and other *Censored Word* function problems. Unlike humans, an intact male dog beyond 4 years of age can be prone to problems if they are not used in a regular breeding program.

[sengeoz]

And for whatever it is worth, there is no age beyond which it is not safe to neuter a male. And the "frustrated" male arises because there is a bitch in season somewhere close. No male dog will suffer from not siring puppies. However, an un-neutered male can suffer health issues simply by virtue of being left intact.

[diesel]

When I got diesel neutered, there was very little changes. I'd say to go for it !

[Discipula]

Thanks for all the replies, everyone. Still need to find a Vet I trust more to discuss it.

[sengeoz]

Dscipula:
Try contacting Cindy Green with Central New York Chow Rescue. She is a Chow breeder, exhibitor and a wealth of knowledge. She may be able to recommend a vet in your area that is Chow aware.

[gebower]

Hello Everyone,

This is my last reply on this subject. The behavior may be "ingrained" but, the hormones enforce that behavior. I've seen it myself. Zeena would be DEAD by now if I hadn't got Max neutered. DEAD. That is the way he was, OUT OF THE GATE, as a puppy. Now, he's the nicest going Chow of all. A sweetheart. Very mellow. He wanted to KILL everything before he was neutered, including humans. Maybe he had just TOO much testosterone?
Look at male elephants. Easy going until they go into "musth" and then all hell breaks loose for recess with them. Very aggressive. WHY? Hormones. I rest my case. Put a fork in me, I'm done on this one.

[kitten1426]

Dscipula:
Try contacting Cindy Green with Central New York Chow Rescue. She is a Chow breeder, exhibitor and a wealth of knowledge. She may be able to recommend a vet in your area that is Chow aware.

I agree 100% Cindy is a great person and knows alot about our chows....We got Kodi from her..he is in the picture below...lol.