Need some advice on Chewie and my daughter.

[Mandy]

Hey All.

I know it has been a while and I'm on here because I need some help/advice. For those of you who don't know me or my family, we have been a part of this site for MANY years and as of the past couple years, I have only lurked and written occasionally. I have 1 chow, a shaded red love named Chewie, who is going to be 6 this year (can you believe that?), a husband, and a 14 month old daughter. Until recently, Chewie had a buddy named Cayenne who was our other sweet little chow. She passed away a few months back and broke our hearts.

I hesitated coming on here to ask for help as I'm never sure what to expect and coming on the site still brings back some sad memories for me. But I would really love to pick your brains on what is going on here at home with Chewie.

Chewie has always been a tough little boy chow. Not so tough that he won't lay on us and give us kisses but tough enough that he will only take so much love. He has had surgeries on both of his back legs for torn ACL's and has arthritis in both knees. We are trying to help him lose a little weight - he is weighing in around 65 lbs right now - vet wants him down to 58 or so. We will be putting him on a high level Omega-3 food soon as prescribed by our vet and he is not currently on any pain medicine. He recently had a bad yeast infection in one of his ears but that has been cleared up for about a month. He has always been protective of me, sees my husband as the alpha, obeys commands well, and has had a life of love with both of us. He is our first chow and our first baby. We got him as puppy and tried to really work on socializing - with a few missteps along the way. He has never loved children - tolerated them but not at all affectionate with them. We have never forced this issue.

When Kennedy, our daughter, came into the picture, Chewie was VERY confused. For a while, he couldn't figure out who to protect - me or Kennedy - and would walk from place to place if we were separated trying to know who to guard. We had one incidence when he tried to establish a new pecking order, with him on top, and growled and nipped my husband when he in for a play wrestle (which had NEVER happened before). At that time, we brought a trainer in the house to better understand what was going on in his mind and to help us do the right thing. We started on the NILIF for a couple months and things seemed okay. He never voluntarily went up to Kennedy but would give her a lick on her hand when we asked him to come and give her a kiss. When we lost Cayenne we expected another attempt at the chain of command as things in the house were changing and he did growl at Drew once. Cayenne was Kennedy's playmate and once she was gone, she has tried to engage Chewie but he always runs away. I NEVER leave them alone together and if they are in the same room, I am always right there with them. She has no fear of him and always says "Hi Chewie" "Bye Chewie" etc. Just so cute. Once, Kennedy was sitting next to him, and went to stand up and put her heands on his back legs. Chewie growled at her and got up and walked away. I told him NO VERY forcefully but not angrily and put him outside. I know that what he did was perfectly understandable as she touched his bad legs and gave her a warning but I still can't have him growling at her. That was about a month ago.

The reason I am writing is this: today he kind of snapped at her. He was sitting down in front of the fan - we (Chewie, Kennedy and I) had just been out for a walk. Kennedy had a stick in her hand and was walking around. She got near to chewie (had already walked by him about 15 times) and held out a stick to him (like she was trying to share). She did not poke him or really even come very close to him but she was near his back legs. He turned his head, let out a tiny growl and I really can't remember if he snapped or just barred his teeth. My heart leapt into my chest and I jumped up, yelled NO and walked Chewie away from her. I laid him down gently and put my hand on him and told him to stay. I stood there over him for a few minutes and then walked away. He then got up without me saying he could and my husband got angry and yelled CHEWIE NO! and he growled at him as he sat him down. I told Drew to calm down, he did, and he calmly told Chewie to lay back down. He wouldn't do it on his own so my husband gently moved his front legs down. Then he walked away told him to stay and Chewie stayed until he told him it was okay to get up. It was Kennedy's bedtime a few minutes later and I asked Chewie to come say goodnight and I held out Kennedy's hand and he gave her a couple of kisses.

At this point, my plan is to get him to the vet this week and see if he recommends any kind of pain management. We also need to get him out for a good walk every day - we have not been great about that. He gets about 3 walks a week. We will be changing his food when I get it from the vet. I plan to contact that trainer that we saw before and have her come back to the house. We will also be restarting the NILIF with his going out, going for walks, eating, getting pets, etc. We have the bottom floor of our house separated into two sections so anytime he wants or needs to get away from her, he can.

Do you think Chewie may need a friend?

I would really like to know if there is some method to helping a chow get used to the touch of a child or if this is just the way he will always be. Kennedy is INCREDIBLY gentle for a toddler and we have worked on it since she was able to pick her hand how to pet a dog "gentle." She NEVER hits, rarely pulls any fur and always approaches slowly. It's almost as if she knows that Chewie can only take so much. Up till now, they have always seemed to have an unspoken agreement on the level of communication.

Those of you that know me, know that Chewie is here to stay. But I would really like to not be afraid that Chewie may bite Kennedy. It has not happened but my fear is there.

Any advice you all have would be GREATLY appreciated. I know I am not on here often but I do think of you all as my extended chow family.

Thank you in advance.

[kingalls]

Hi,
Very happy to hear from you again - any chance of getting a recent picture of Kennedy? I remember the pix of her after she first arrived.
Unfortunately, I don't have any first hand advice to give you but my first thought is that there might be some pain issues with Chewie. Hopefully, others can help with good advice & suggestions.

[Sirchow]

This is such a hard one and I don't know if I have anything very helpful to offer just a few little tweeks. I am wondering what supplements Chewie is on as he needs a good glucosamine, chondroitin, MSM and Hyaluronic acid supplement, he could also do with fish oil, not salmon oil in this case as it is for anti-inflamatory properties I would also give him a daily probiotic which helps with yeast infections but also help with his ability to tollerate the supplements and not get an upset tummy from it. Fish oil and MSM are both anti-inflamatories. Stear clear of joint supplements that have brewers yeast and MSG (monosodiumglutamate) in them. I can give you a link to the one Bramble takes if it is any help. She tore both ccl's before reaching 6 months so I know how hard that has been for you.

It sounds to me as if he is protecting his legs. Bramble is very protective of hers and we all know being a lot older to be very careful. For Chewie he never knows when Kennedy is going to stummble on to his or poke them and sometimes if they are a bit sore he probably just wants to left alone. My feeling from your post and I am sticking my neck out and could be entirely wrong is that he would not bite her. But you never know and I can tell how unnerving this must be for you. When Kennedy hurts herself can you use this to tell her how sore Chewies legs are and that he is scared that she will hurt them. Use her experience to make it real how Chewie feels. I know she is only little but her understanding will grow every day.

I think your idea to give time appart is a good one and also to see what the vet thinks of his pain level. Chewie running away from Kennedy reminds me of how our older male cats react when a kitten comes into the house. They know they must not hurt it and when they get very frustrated or annoyed they run away. It is what males do when they can't cope with baby creatures. (oops that wasn't meant to include humans as well ) It is the females in the animal kingdom that disapline babies so Chewie needs you to protect him till Kennedy is old enough to take that responsibility. That may be some time.

As to another dog. If you went that route I think you would need to be very careful and get an older dog that is not going to want to play and that is very child friendly. Dogs learn a lot from watching each other and I think this might even help Chewie. Could you even borrow a dog for a few weeks that has these qualities that Chewie gets on with.

Well I am rambling now so I will stop. As Kingalls said a few pictures would be nice.

[chowpups]

Sorry to hear Chewies behavior is acting alittle out of sorts.. Having to bum legs isn't a good combo with little toddlers.. or anyone who just doesn't get it.. My older chow had a bad ear and it would definitely flare at times and one would not dare touch it while petting or else.. not that she ever bit anyone but she would flinch and show a tooth or two and snarl .. with legs its hard to tell when a bad day is going to flare up .. so I'd be very careful and have the vet check them maybe something is bothering Chewie to be that reactive all of a sudden..
I have a small grandson(18months) who thinks Nikki is the best thing to go run and lay down on when shes just trying to sleep so I too have to make sure he is very careful approaching her.. and she doesn't have any problems (that I know of) but just the fact that Nikki doesn't have a small child around daily or even monthly to understand their quick, loud and sometimes clumsey moves. Its tough but its something that has to be monitored. And Nikki has never growled or nipped but she is big and knocks my grandson over too.. Hasn't ever meant to hurt but sometimes the floor is not forgiving to a child..

[LEO's mum]

Nice to hear from you Mandy. Sorry to hear about the troubles. I got LEO's weight down from 68lb to 57lb, her ideal weight, by cutting her breakfast out and going for light dinner only. I do still feed her about 1/2 ~ 3/4 cup kibbles on walks as treats to keep her moving or getting attention away from other dogs. She responds better to treats/kibbles as she is hungry.

As for the supplements, I'll PM you.

Please give Kennedy & Chewie big hugs from us,
Leonora & mum

[chow fancier]

I would agree that Chewie may be in pain and that needs to be addressed. Supplements are important with his leg problems, too. Please have him checked out and if he needs pain mgmt, provide it. My Chana had arthritis her last few years and 1 buffered aspirin a day and her supplements was all it took to make her comfortable - no expensive and dangerous drugs.

But the thing that stuck out to me from your post is that you were going to do NILF again. In my limited experience, it has to be all the time, not just for a period of time when you are having problems. Chows are smart and will soon notice that they are not required to work for a living, which means they are in charge rather than the human servants that they allow to live in their house. We have never consciously stopped NILF, but occassionally will falter and let something slide. Whenever we get a little easy on ours, they suddenly become brats.

Chewie and all your family are in my prayers.

[Auddymay]

Wonderful to hear from you Mandy. As I read your post, I kept thinking it was time for another Chow, not so much for Chew, but for Kennedy and Drew. NILF sounds the way to go, and of course, managed together time is a must. I think Chewie feels he is competing more now for your attention, and with the pain, has a lower tolerance. Lily is not fond of children either, unless it is her choice. While Chew acquesses to Drew and recognizes Drew's authority, Cay was always there to be Drew's girl, and as such, didn't feel ruled by Drew. That has changed, Chewie's buffer is gone. I agree with everyone else, time for more Kennedy photos. And a chowling.