Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

General discussions about Chow Chows.

Moderator: chowadmin

wallacethegreat
Rank 1
Rank 1
Posts: 289
Joined: Mon Apr 28, 2008 9:36 am
Location: Cedar Grove, New Mexico

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by wallacethegreat » Fri Jun 13, 2008 2:58 pm

For the most part, health checks are a precursory vet check...no, the pup does not have parvo; no, the pup isn't crippled yet; no, the pup doesn't LOOK like it has entropion; no, the pup LOOKS healthy, well-fed, and happy; no, the pup doesn't have bordatella (kennel cough); no, the pup is still moving and seems to be alive. Vets can't even check for hip dysplasia, at least according to MY vet, until the dog is about ay ear old. Unless it has OFA certification, you just won't know until it's too late. You know. That moment when you decide to take the now adult-Chow to the pound because you can't afford hip relacement surgery. Got $5000 for two hips? Step on in and sign up now. You can't? Take the Chow to the pound. Too much trouble, not to mention money.
ANYBODY can get a "health check" from their vet. Do you think the vet would have said, "I'm sorry. Berkley cannot travel from LA to ABQ because he has entropion."?
These "breeders" have some vets up their wazoos and can get the ok just to sell any pups because they get a lot of business. Oh? That didn't occur to you?
I'm not saying anybody should go to "breeders" or get shelter dogs. All I'm saying is that taking on the commitment to another living creature, with a heart, mind, and soul, should take a bit more thought than...OMG! Isn't he/she cute?"
Laura Mac, the militant shelter rescue b*tch (also mama to my Berkley now and my angel boy, Wallace)
Laura Mac, mama to Fozzie-Bear and to Berkley-Bear and Oliver Wallace, my angel Chows

vicster605
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 4304
Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2007 10:20 pm
Location: New Orleans,La.

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by vicster605 » Fri Jun 13, 2008 3:09 pm

I agree with Melanie, I have always thought and still do that there are people who go to breeders and people who go to shelters/rescues, some that do BOTH. If someone goes to a breeder and doesn't find a breeder it doesn't mean they will go to a shelter/rescue INSTEAD but they will continue to search for another breeder and you probably couldn't change their mind. Kearra came from a BYB and I had NO IDEA what the term meant. I have since found out EXACTLY what it means. Kearra was diagnosised with HD. And the so called breeder said she was THE ONLY ONE that had EVER had a problem. Since Chow Fest and meeting Cinder's Mom I found out that Kearra has a sister (same father) and her Chow has Elbow Dysplasia........ Guess what, she was told the same thing. I got Kyra from a BYB or was she a rescue???? Or was she BOTH LOL!!! she has been walking with a sight limp lately from time to time and she had Entropian .....I haven't taken her in for a Vet check yet on the occasional limp (maybe wishful thinking)but I do have my suspitions as to whats going on with her and will find out soon enough. Will I rescue again.....maybe....maybe not. After paying to replace Kearra's hips in the near future, and paying for Kyra's Entropian surgery and whatever else is wrong with her....and not being able to afford new underware afterwards lol I may consider buying from a good breeder next time instead......for the simple reason that the pain of watching my VERY loved Chows suffer and having my pocketbook suffer only to have their lives shortened (more than likely) due to health reason I'm not sure if I will be willing to go thru that again or at least may want to decrease the odds of my next Chow having the same problems not sure about that one yet. Does that make me a bad person.....I don't think so..... I'm also like Leo's Mom and have to get a puppy for peace of mind since we have 6 grandchildren ranging in age from 3 mos to 11yrs old & children here almost all the time.....can't take a chance on an adult I don't know very well.
I really don't care where anyone got their Chows and LOVE them all on this site. I respect everyone on this site that love and take good care of their Chows WHERE EVER THEY CAME FROM. I also respect those that do what they can for the rescues and I have tryed to help out when I can. I don't understand WHY it has to be rescues vs breeder Chows as I feel its the stupid ignorant people that don't take their job of owning a pet seriously and want to get them and then get rid of them thats the BIGGEST problem we have (in the US). GOOD breeders don't let their Chows go to rescues or shelters. BYB's deny EVERYTHING and your on your own if something is wrong and could CARE LESS if they go to a shelter/rescue as long as they have their $$$$$$ They are the ones that supply the shelters/rescues along with the people who throw away their pets.
Chow fancier love your personal credo =D=
Image

Thanks Sweetpea!

User avatar
Layla
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 3599
Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2007 9:46 pm
Location: Seattle

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by Layla » Fri Jun 13, 2008 3:12 pm

Coco Chow wrote:Finding a good puppy from a good breeder costs a lot of time and money, I don't call that easy.
Hell no. I had to do more paper work for be considered for Alf's home than my two rescues combined.
Image
Thank you Elodie!

User avatar
Red Dragon
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 1946
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2006 6:03 pm

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by Red Dragon » Fri Jun 13, 2008 3:18 pm

Darn Vicster, are the vet bills getting into your underwear fund! :lol: I knew you had spent a bunch of money, but didn't know it was getting that bad yet. :shock: I hope you don't have to do the hip replacement, that will seriously put a damper on you undies situation, I think you might have to go commando at that point. :lol:
Sam

Keeper of the furry things...Master of the kibble....Scooper of the poo!

User avatar
Red Dragon
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 1946
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2006 6:03 pm

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by Red Dragon » Fri Jun 13, 2008 3:21 pm

Layla wrote:
Coco Chow wrote:Finding a good puppy from a good breeder costs a lot of time and money, I don't call that easy.
Hell no. I had to do more paper work for be considered for Alf's home than my two rescues combined.
And what did all that paperwork get you? I would sure like to know where he came from, I like to keep track of that stuff. 8)
Sam

Keeper of the furry things...Master of the kibble....Scooper of the poo!

User avatar
Rowlee
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 1008
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2007 12:51 am
Location: Mandurah, Western Australia

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by Rowlee » Fri Jun 13, 2008 3:23 pm

Coco Chow wrote:I come on cc.org to share your stories and also for advice on how to keep Coco happy and healthy.

I just feel sad when I feel a finger is pointed at me, because I got Coco, when she was a puppy, and from a breeder.

I got her from a breeder and I don't regret buying her because she's all I wanted. FYI There is NO way I could have found her in a French shelter.

It looks like bad, bad people all over this website?

We all love our chows. Some are just being narrow minded and it's a shame they talk louder than everybody else.
=D= =D= =D= Well said Elodie and Mally for that matter.

I refuse to be made to feel like a bad person because I bought my chow from a breeder. As Mally said and as I have said before, there are no chow shelters in Australia. I couldn't get a rescue chow if I wanted to and personally, and I am being completely honest here, i don't think I could deal with a rescue and the problems that they can have. Gosh I have enough trouble dealing with the Monster Dog, WIlbur George, some days as it is :lol: :lol:
Image

Thanks so much Sweetpea, you're a star!

User avatar
Rowlee
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 1008
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2007 12:51 am
Location: Mandurah, Western Australia

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by Rowlee » Fri Jun 13, 2008 3:29 pm

IliamnasQuest wrote:
WildThings wrote:Not every breeder is bad, but until we demand the highest possible standards from all breeders, we are all part of the problem, it’s too bad the innocent pay the price.
To me, this is the problem - not breeder vs. rescue.

I think ALL the chows on this site are very special to the people who live with them. I don't think any one chow is better than another. I think those who rescue are wonderful people, and those who help with rescue in whatever way they can are also wonderful people. But I absolutely, 100%, no doubt in my mind believe that if we don't have good breeders who are breeding for type, health and temperament, then we will lose what we know as the "chow". And to that end, I do believe that there's a necessity for breeders and for people who purchase from breeders.

I get tremendously irked at people who buy from bad breeders. It's one thing if you are new to the scene, don't know, don't think to research what makes a breeder good or bad. We've all made our mistakes and I'm no exception - twenty years ago, my first purebred dog (GSD) came from a BYB. But when someone is a member of this forum or on chow email lists and they KNOW that when they purchase from a breeder who doesn't health certify, doesn't believe in proving their dogs in any way, then as far as I'm concerned they are deliberately adding to the problem. They're financing a bad breeder who will take that money as confirmation that breeding is a profitable enterprise and that breeder is going to pump out as many puppies as possible - to the detriment of the breed and the individual bitches being bred. Some of these bitches are bred EVERY heat cycle for cycle after cycle after cycle - and who thinks to ask about that?

Melanie and the gang in Alaska

I couldn't agree more Melanie & Wild Things, that is the problem, bad breeders not breeders in general.

WIlbur's breeder is the best, most caring and helpful person going and I adore her. She has been wonderful. She has had to take puppies and dogs back from people because they were not being cared for properly or didn't want the dog anymore (yes, true, "we're having a baby and can't keep the dog now, after six years.....). She then has to rehome those chows. That's what a good breeder will do. They are responsible for those dogs for the lifespan of the dog.
Image

Thanks so much Sweetpea, you're a star!

vicster605
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 4304
Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2007 10:20 pm
Location: New Orleans,La.

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by vicster605 » Fri Jun 13, 2008 3:36 pm

LOL Sam, not yet but I'm sure it will.....at least I won't have to worry about panty lines then :lol:
Image

Thanks Sweetpea!

User avatar
Jeff&Peks
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 8386
Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2005 10:29 am
Location: Los Angeles,, CA

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by Jeff&Peks » Fri Jun 13, 2008 3:46 pm

I doubt any of your store bought Chows took a month of arguing, $250 in phone calls, driving 4 hours aday for 2 weeks and calling every city official in LA just to keep three Chows alive. Trying to get a Chow out of a shelter once it has been red tagged can't compared to Sitting on a Pc trying to decide who is a good breeder or not... As I said, Its much easier to just go to a pet shop or a breeder and buy a Chow, for most of those people buying from a breeder or pet shop its just as easy to dump the Chow at a shelter when it turns a year old and dosn't fit the life style anymore then just go buy a new one, no effort involved either way. As the lady once said, why should I change my life style or waste my time on a dawgggg. Another valued member that left the site. Puppies and baby's are attention getters thats why they are being pumped out by the hour...

There is one good thing about breeders, no one can be rejected by a breeder or pet shop like they could by a rescue or Shelter, I can see being rejected by a Rescue but rejected by a shelter, thats really bad. So the breeder and pet shops do serve a purpose.
“...There comes a time when one must take a position that is neither safe, nor politic, nor popular, but one must take it because conscience tells one that it is right.” MLK

ImageImage

User avatar
chow fancier
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 1580
Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2007 12:26 am
Location: Rockford, IL

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by chow fancier » Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:00 pm

Jeff&Peks wrote: There is one good thing about breeders, no one can be rejected by a breeder or pet shop like they could by a rescue or Shelter, I can see being rejected by a Rescue but rejected by a shelter, thats really bad. So the breeder and pet shops do serve a purpose.

Actually, good breeders do reject prospective buyers. A good breeder screens the buyers making every effort to assure the animal gets a good forever home. When I first left home, still in my late teens (20 some years ago), I did not qualify to buy a Keeshond from a breeder because my income was insufficient and my home on a month to month rental. The breeder was attempting to assure that the dog wouldn't end up in a shelter because I had to move or couldn't afford the dogs healthcare.
Jerilyn
Image
Banner courtesy of the amazing Sweetpea.

Until there are none, adopt one!

http://www.dogster.com/dogs/631376
http://www.dogster.com/dogs/650868

User avatar
Red Dragon
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 1946
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2006 6:03 pm

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by Red Dragon » Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:00 pm

Jeff&Peks wrote:I doubt any of your store bought Chows took a month of arguing, $250 in phone calls, driving 4 hours aday for 2 weeks and calling every city official in LA just to keep three Chows alive. Trying to get a Chow out of a shelter once it has been red tagged can't compared to Sitting on a Pc trying to decide who is a good breeder or not... As I said, Its much easier to just go to a pet shop or a breeder and buy a Chow, for most of those people buying from a breeder or pet shop its just as easy to dump the Chow at a shelter when it turns a year old and dosn't fit the life style anymore then just go buy a new one, no effort involved either way. As the lady once said, why should I change my life style or waste my time on a dawgggg. Another valued member that left the site. Puppies and baby's are attention getters thats why they are being pumped out by the hour...

There is one good thing about breeders, no one can be rejected by a breeder or pet shop like they could by a rescue or Shelter, I can see being rejected by a Rescue but rejected by a shelter, thats really bad. So the breeder and pet shops do serve a purpose.
Jeff, you amaze me at some of the crap you type, where do you come up with this garbage? I will have you know that I have driven all over this country looking at Chows to buy from breeders. And you couldn't come by with a Brinks truck loaded with money and buy some of these peoples Chows if they didn't think you were the right person for the dog. I'll bet I could back up to the shelter with a truck load of money and leave there with a truck load of dogs though. :lol:
Sam

Keeper of the furry things...Master of the kibble....Scooper of the poo!

User avatar
Rowlee
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 1008
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2007 12:51 am
Location: Mandurah, Western Australia

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by Rowlee » Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:01 pm

Jeff&Peks wrote: There is one good thing about breeders, no one can be rejected by a breeder or pet shop like they could by a rescue or Shelter, I can see being rejected by a Rescue but rejected by a shelter, thats really bad. So the breeder and pet shops do serve a purpose.
Well you're wrong about that Jeff. I know several chow breeders now all of whom have rejected potential puppy buyers because they didn't believe they were suitable and were not happy to sell one of their puppies to them. Once again we are talking about RESPONSIBLE breeders and there are plenty of them.
Image

Thanks so much Sweetpea, you're a star!

User avatar
Jeff&Peks
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 8386
Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2005 10:29 am
Location: Los Angeles,, CA

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by Jeff&Peks » Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:07 pm

Some of you people do live in fantasy world now don't you. Red dragon, I could drive to your farm and put $500 on the table and walk out with every puppy you have unless you had another buyer and had to save one, I think you have fallen off your chair one to many times.

I like your sales pitch, "why shoot for a few dollars more you could buy a Chow from me why go to that breeder". Did you PM your phone number and offer to throw in a bag of proplan.

I could walk across the street to the pet shop right now and buy his 5 remaining purebread Lab puppies with all the paperwork and not be ask one question, he could care if i'm planning on BBQ Labrador this weekend.
Last edited by Jeff&Peks on Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:17 pm, edited 2 times in total.
“...There comes a time when one must take a position that is neither safe, nor politic, nor popular, but one must take it because conscience tells one that it is right.” MLK

ImageImage

User avatar
Red Dragon
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 1946
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2006 6:03 pm

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by Red Dragon » Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:14 pm

Jeff, I probably would sell you "A" dog if you came looking for one, but it would be alot more than $500, and it would be because you have proven you could take care of one, you did take care of Peks. I don't like all the false information you have about alot of stuff though, and the rescue bit gets carried a little too far some times, but other than that you seem like a good enough guy. :lol:
Sam

Keeper of the furry things...Master of the kibble....Scooper of the poo!

User avatar
Red Dragon
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 1946
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2006 6:03 pm

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by Red Dragon » Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:27 pm

Jeff&Peks wrote:Some of you people do live in fantasy world now don't you. Red dragon, I could drive to your farm and put $500 on the table and walk out with every puppy you have unless you had another buyer and had to save one, I think you have fallen off your chair one to many times.

I like your sales pitch, "why shoot for a few dollars more you could buy a Chow from me why go to that breeder". Did you PM your phone number and offer to throw in a bag of proplan.

I could walk across the street to the pet shop right now and buy his 5 remaining purebread Lab puppies with all the paperwork and not be ask one question, he could care if i'm planning on BBQ Labrador this weekend.
Well duh! They are a pet shop, they are in BUSINESS to sell dogs, you can bet they will sell to the first person with cash, they would even offer you a discount to buy them all, no doubt about that! :lol:
Sam

Keeper of the furry things...Master of the kibble....Scooper of the poo!

User avatar
Tippsy'smom
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 3123
Joined: Tue Oct 03, 2006 7:28 am
Location: McDonough, GA
Contact:

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by Tippsy'smom » Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:34 pm

Shoot Pet shops also try to pass off some breeds for others. My aunt went into one thinking she was buying a yorkie and came out with a silky terrier. She's very nieve and keeps insisting that Anabell isn't a silky but I guess if she's happy in her little farietale land, whatever. :wall:
Jess
R.I.P. Cinder~1992-1994, Tippsy~9/00-4/11, Jasper~10/08-10/14, Todd~2/11-7/15
Dixie: mix Rebel: mix

User avatar
Jeff&Peks
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 8386
Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2005 10:29 am
Location: Los Angeles,, CA

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by Jeff&Peks » Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:38 pm

Red Dragon wrote:
Jeff&Peks wrote:Some of you people do live in fantasy world now don't you. Red dragon, I could drive to your farm and put $500 on the table and walk out with every puppy you have unless you had another buyer and had to save one, I think you have fallen off your chair one to many times.

I like your sales pitch, "why shoot for a few dollars more you could buy a Chow from me why go to that breeder". Did you PM your phone number and offer to throw in a bag of proplan.

I could walk across the street to the pet shop right now and buy his 5 remaining purebread Lab puppies with all the paperwork and not be ask one question, he could care if i'm planning on BBQ Labrador this weekend.
Well duh! They are a pet shop, they are in BUSINESS to sell dogs, you can bet they will sell to the first person with cash, they would even offer you a discount to buy them all, no doubt about that! :lol:

Well Duh!, where did those puppies come from, Do I hear breeder. He has no problem giving out the breeders names and addresses if he doesn't have what you want he will send you to them, he's not hiding anything, according to him his breeders are the best around, AKC approved with full medical honors.

What are you in the breading BUSINESS for if not to sell and make money? oh never mind I forgot "To better the Breed" Yours are free.
“...There comes a time when one must take a position that is neither safe, nor politic, nor popular, but one must take it because conscience tells one that it is right.” MLK

ImageImage

User avatar
Red Dragon
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 1946
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2006 6:03 pm

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by Red Dragon » Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:44 pm

The dogs in the pet shops come from commercial breeders and puppymills most of the time. Just because they are AKC approved doesn't mean a whole lot, all it means is the y keep the paperwork in order and the dogs have food, water, shelter, and a place to stand other than their own feces and urine.

I am trying to better the breed, unfortunately that costs a bunch of money, so no you are not getting a dog for free! :lol:
Sam

Keeper of the furry things...Master of the kibble....Scooper of the poo!

IliamnasQuest
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 1010
Joined: Fri Feb 17, 2006 8:04 am
Location: Alaska

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by IliamnasQuest » Fri Jun 13, 2008 5:54 pm

Good breeders don't sell to anyone who happens to have the money. To say otherwise is to spread lies.

Puppies sold through pet stores do NOT come from good breeders.

As far as the health checks go, I'm talking about OFA certifications on the ADULTS being bred, not on the puppies. OFA certifications on hips and elbows require the dog to be at least two years old. I believe you can do thyroid, patellas, cardiac and eyes at a year old. So you can't get any of these done on a puppy. The concept is to provide the best genetic BACKGROUND you can in the hopes that the pups will then not have any of these genetic diseases. And the way that is done is to first buy good breeding stock that has a strong background in OFA certifications, and then certify your dogs prior to breeding (which means you need to wait until they're two years old).

Genetics are important, but casual breeders don't pay any attention to genetics. They get a "purebred" chow and breed it to another "purebred" chow and then think they can sell the puppies for big bucks. And suckers come along to buy those pups, providing a market that will continue until people quit being suckers and quit supporting these bad breeders.

I keep talking about Khana because she shows what good genetics can do. I don't plan to breed her, but I did get all her OFA certifications done in order to provide information to the owners of her parents and other relatives. Khana's father passed all six OFA certifications, so did his brother, and so has Khana. This is important information for people to know - breeding for health WORKS. And I put in the money to have her certified even though she's likely going to be spayed soon, when many people who are actually breeding and selling pups can't be bothered to even do the simplest of OFA certifications. These people aren't truly "breeders". They're opportunistic bottom-dwellers who feed off of the emotional attachment people get when they look at a cute picture of a chow puppy.

I don't know about it being easier to buy a chow than to get one from a shelter. My Mom just got a shelter dog here. She walked in and they bent over backwards to talk her into taking this dog (who is really more dog than she should have - he's high energy, she's in her 80's). She paid her money (got a senior citizen discount) and walked out with her dog minutes later. It took me a year to find Khana, many phone calls long distance, and I paid for shipping from Ontario, Canada to Alaska. Would have been much easier (and cheaper) to walk into a shelter and get a dog. But I'm absolutely thankful that I found the pup I did, and I'd buy from this breeder again in a heartbeat. I don't dump my dogs and I've never sent a dog to the pound. I'm not ever going to feel guilty because I chose to buy this puppy.

Melanie and the gang in Alaska
... is a "purebread" dog one that is all whole wheat?

wallacethegreat
Rank 1
Rank 1
Posts: 289
Joined: Mon Apr 28, 2008 9:36 am
Location: Cedar Grove, New Mexico

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by wallacethegreat » Fri Jun 13, 2008 6:00 pm

To both Jeff and Red Dragon....Amen.
Jeff, you and I know how hard it was to get Berkley out of that shelter. I've done it for a long time with other breeds, but anyone new to pulling shelter dogs will turn militant about shelter dogs in a heartbeat. It doesn't take much to turn your heart around and realize this is a huge problem in the U.S.
I don't care if people want to buy from breeders, but as I said before, at least have the common sense and intelligence to pick a GOOD one.
Even though Shanlee continues to ask questions, she just isn't listening.
One hopes she's an adult and will learn from her mistakes. Let's also hope the Chows she buys don't pay for that in the end.
Laura Mac, the militant shelter rescue b*tch (also mama to my Berkley now and my angel boy, Wallace)
Laura Mac, mama to Fozzie-Bear and to Berkley-Bear and Oliver Wallace, my angel Chows

wallacethegreat
Rank 1
Rank 1
Posts: 289
Joined: Mon Apr 28, 2008 9:36 am
Location: Cedar Grove, New Mexico

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by wallacethegreat » Fri Jun 13, 2008 6:05 pm

Melanie...the difference between you and some "others" on the group" are glaring. You did your research, you did all the right things with certifications, etc. That's a smart and savvy buyer who really just wants to get a healthy pup from a breeder. But if you read this stuff about the 4-day old Chowlings, you'll see there is a marked difference between how you conducted your search and what others are doing.
I say, Good for you! That's the way a breeder purchase should work!
Laura Mac, the militant shelter rescue b*tch (also mama to my Berkley now and my angel boy, Wallace)
Laura Mac, mama to Fozzie-Bear and to Berkley-Bear and Oliver Wallace, my angel Chows

User avatar
Jeff&Peks
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 8386
Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2005 10:29 am
Location: Los Angeles,, CA

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by Jeff&Peks » Fri Jun 13, 2008 6:11 pm

To save the unknowing some time and trouble and to stop the never ending discussion about good and bad breeders why don't the 4 people that push good breeding put up a list of who they feel are good Breeders in the US Obviously people don't know and make it by state so the unknowing won't have to travel across the US.

There is a big difference with what goes on in Europe then what goes on in the US, 40, 000 dogs a year being put to sleep and 1500 a month coming out of LA, these dogs have to be coming from somewhere. Most of the people saying we need breeders don't have 20 purebred Chows aday dieing in 7 LA county shelters. People that have 5 Chows in the whole country shouldn't be arguing with People that have hundreds of Chows per city with half of them being put to sleep everyday.
“...There comes a time when one must take a position that is neither safe, nor politic, nor popular, but one must take it because conscience tells one that it is right.” MLK

ImageImage

User avatar
kingalls
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 3513
Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2005 9:09 pm
Location: Central California

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by kingalls » Fri Jun 13, 2008 7:13 pm

Judy Fox wrote:
However, back to the original subject - how refreshing to see this subject discussed in an adult and more kindly manner - as it should be.
well, that was short-lived.
Karen, Kohana, Takoda, and our Chow Angels Nahkohe and Shiloh

User avatar
Laura
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 2196
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2007 7:33 pm
Location: Alabama

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by Laura » Fri Jun 13, 2008 7:43 pm

lol Jeff the people that have come on here asking for recommendations of good breeders get ran off. People trying to do their homework like everyone seems to expect come to a place you would think would be a wealth of information on the subject and I have yet to see a single breeder be mentioned. Even our members who ARE breeders get constantly badgered. The people who buy from breeders get criticized and attacked and ran off as well.
I have no problem with health testing of course but I have two things to say...#1. I had never even heard of OFA testing much less knew wth a patella was until I joined this site. #2 Until Chloe I have never owned a chow who had been ofa or any kind of health testing to my knowledge. I have owned 5 chows and one chow shelter rescue and not one has ever had hip displasia, entropian or any other breed specific health issues so far. No health issues at all except normal things due to age, cancer, and the like. Not everyone on the planet is as educated as some of the people on this site are. That is a fact and I am living proof. Not every dog purchased from a 'bad' breeder has health issues and not every dog purchased from a 'wonderful' breeder escapes them. I might be on here in 6 mos crying because Shug or Chloe have hip displasia or entropian but that is a risk I knew I was taking when I bought a CHOW. I read on this forum about health testing prior to getting Chloe so Iooked for that from her breeder. I learned it here...on my own...no one yelled at me. I simply read the advice and took it to heart. I was also convinced Shug wouldn't live out the week but he is still hanging in there and I am still worrying about his lack of health testing in the family.
Instead of rail-roading people out of town it might be nice if they could all be gently educated. If they come here wanting to buy a pup it would be nice if some of the people who insist they be bought from 'reputable' breeders provided them with who exactly those breeders are. It would be nice if advice was given in a gentle manner, help was offered, and the attacks and criticisms were non existent. It would be nice if a new member found the site and came to share their joy about their new chow pup w/out getting screamed at for not rescuing or because of what breeder they purchased from.
The turn this thread has taken has gone off course IMO. For the record not all of us who buy from breeders drop them off at the local shelter at the first sign of illness anymore then those who rescue return them to the shelter for the same reason. I would love to stand outside a shelter and shoot every person who drops a dog off. They can all rot in hell as far as I am concerned but I can assure you that just because I bought from a breeder that I, nor 99% of the people on this site would ever take their Chow to a shelter for ANY reason. I will not be lumped into that category and there is far too much of that mentioned in this thread. I will not be personally blamed for the shelter situation and the vibe here is that we who bought from breeders are the cause of the shelter situation.
Image
Chloe (left) Shuggy (right)

User avatar
Layla
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 3599
Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2007 9:46 pm
Location: Seattle

Re: Rescue Chows vs Breeder Chows

Post by Layla » Fri Jun 13, 2008 8:56 pm

Red Dragon wrote:
Layla wrote:
Coco Chow wrote:Finding a good puppy from a good breeder costs a lot of time and money, I don't call that easy.
Hell no. I had to do more paper work for be considered for Alf's home than my two rescues combined.
And what did all that paperwork get you? I would sure like to know where he came from, I like to keep track of that stuff. 8)
You can only load the dice in your favour Sam, you know that as much as I do. What it got me was a boy with a lovely temperament & great looks :D From his breeder, I got advice, an offer to take him back if I didn't want to spend the money one him (they didn't want to risk him ending up in a shelter) & all my purchase money back.... I'm pretty happy with that to be honest. I did my homework, there is health testing on the parents & 3 of the grandparents.... Sure, I wish he'd been well, but he's got me, my AmEx card & is currently looking pretty dam good! Just like Milo had & Millie has. Once here, they are my responsiblity (no matter where they came from) 'til the day they die.
Image
Thank you Elodie!

Post Reply